Farah Davids answers.....

David Farrah, on Kiwiblog, wrote this nonsense list: http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2009/06/the_david_bain_case.html

Farah Davids answers with some reality. (I take the opportunity to add comment here or there)

DF “So what do you have to believe, to think Robin Bain was the killer. This list is not comprehensive, and is even a bit repetitive. But here goes:

It was a lucky guess when David Bain told 111 ambulance officer they are all dead, despite later saying he only saw two bodies

ans.David Bain told the 111 ambulance officer they are all dead because he was in a highly stressed, confused state, hyperventilating and at that stage his memory was not as impaired as it became

Again a lucky guess hen DB told police officer they are all dead

ans.Again when he told the police officer they were all dead it was before the effects of the stress on memory

The 25 minute gap between DB finding his family dead and calling 111 is in no way connected with trying to wash clothes and removed blood.

ans.The 25 minute gap between getting home and calling 111 was occupied with routine tasks including putting the washing on, then some time of panic as he discovered the bodies

The bruise on David’s head and scratches on his chest and graze on his knee – none of which he could explain, were just a coincidence

ans.The bruises on David’s head were caused by a fall in a state of stress-induced syncope, the scratches on his chest occurred after he had been examined by Dr Pryde, and the injury to his knee was caused in a similar way to the bruises

The lens from his glasses found in Stephen’s room happened weeks ago and he never noticed OR someone else had borrowed the glasses

ans.The lens from his mother’s old glasses appeared in Stephen’s room by some cause other than being involved in a fight with his brother.

The lack of fresh injuries on Robin despite the massive struggle with Stephen is just the product of healthy living

ans.The fresh injuries on Robin Bain’s hands may have been incurred during a fight with Stephen

David’s finger prints on gun are from a previous time

ans.David’s fingerprints on the gun were not indicative of having fired the gun

David telling a friend he had premonition something bad was going to happen was a genuine psychic experience

ans.David telling a friend that he had a sense that something bad was going to happen was because she had not broken up with her previous boyfriend and such complications and deceit usually lead to trouble

Stephen’s blood on David’s clothing was nothing to do with the struggle – OR someone else borrowed his clothes

ans.The small amounts of Stephen’s blood got on David’s clothing through him kneeling down by Stephen’s body and brushing against things

Robin managed to execute his family on a full bladder

ans.Robin’s bladder was not so full that he would necessarily have even been aware of it, let alone have an urgency to pee. The colouration interpreted as ‘concentrated’ may have been due to the delay to autopsy

The lock and key to the rifle being found in David’s room is not relevant as they were obviously placed there

ans.The lock and key to the rifle being found in David’s room makes sense as that’s where the rifle was kept.

Robin decided to wash David’s green jersey to remove blood and the fibres from jersey found under Steven’s finger nails

ans.Robin decided to drop the bloodied jersey into the wash as an automatic thing as he wasn’t thinking straight and he had gone to the bathroom by the laundry to clean himself. The fibres from the jersey found under Stephen’s fingernails were from Stephen fighting with Robin.

David’s bloody palm print on the washing machine was from him checking the bodies

ans.David’s bloody palm print on the washing machine (not visible to the naked eye) was from handling bloodied clothes or some other innocent reason.

...I comment, the indication of blood may have been a reaction to soap powder rather than blood.

The Ambulance officer was wrong when he said in his opinion Bain was pretending to have a fit

ans.The Ambulance officer’s opinion that Bain was pretending to have a fit was wrong, and that the first-response routine suspicion of syncope both fits the symptoms perfectly and does not appear to have been checked for

...I comment, another Ambulance officer present did not share the same opinion as the first.

Robin Bain would logically wear gloves to prevent fingerprints despite it being a murder-suicide

ans.Robin Bain would wear gloves for some unknowable reason despite it being a murder-suicide; and that the blood smears and substance described as blood under his fingernails may have been a residue from wearing the bloodied gloves

...I comment, the blood smears inculpated Robin. They could only have arrived on his hands from being in direct contact with the blood or some item bearing the blood.

That Robin Bain would type a message on a computer for David telling him he is the only one who deserves to live, instead of writing a note. A hand written note incidentally would have cleared David.

ans.That Robin Bain would type a note on the computer trying to explain, and that it may not have occurred to him to think David might be held responsible.

...I comment, not to overlook the computer turn on time excluded David from being home according to the witness Mrs Laney. Robin was a habitual computer user, his choice between a letter or a computer message does not ursurp the forensic proof of suicide discovered in the lounge. At best, the computer message can be seen as irrelevant to either side of the argument when compared to the final death scene.

Also that having just shot his family, and knowing David was due home, that Robin would wait 44 seconds for the computer to boot up to leave a message

ans.Also that having just shot his family, and knowing David was due home, that Robin would wait 44 seconds for the computer to boot up to leave a message rather than leave the room he was in (where he could see out to the street and see David coming) to look for alternative writing materials

...I comment, I'm reluctant to accept what Robin may or may not have been thinking. I expect he would be sated, exhausted, disgusted and frightened by what he had done. To consider he may have some how been rationally considering any aspect of the events of that day or earlier is unhelpful and no conclusion can be drawn.

Robin would decide David deserved to live, but go out of his way to frame him for murder

ans.Robin would decide David deserved to live, and it may not occur to him that David might be charged with murder

Robin Bain placed fibres from Davids jersey under Stephen’s finger nails

ans.Stephen Bain had fibres from a jersey too small for David but worn by Robin under his finger nails

Robin Bain would shoot himself with a gun in the most awkward way possible?

ans.Robin Bain would shoot himself with a gun in a way fairly common for suicide by rifle

...I comment, a right hand dominate suicide by a right handed person is the least awkward temple shot.

That Robin Bain changed jerseys after he had killed his family and in particular Stephen Bain, washed the jersey, hung it on the line and then change into a brown jersey before killing himself?

ans.That Robin Bain removed the bloody jersey after he had killed his family and put it with dirty laundry and then changed into the clothes he had been wearing the night before before killing himself. David washed the jersey, a cop hung it on the line.

...I comment, I didn't know that a police officer hung out the Jury? That sounds bizzare to be frank.

That there is a logical reason that David Bain can not account for the injuries on his face, the bruise or the scraped knee, yet knows he did not have them during his paper run.

ans.That the logical reason that David Bain cannot account for the injuries on his face, the bruise or the scraped knee, yet knows he did not have them during his paper run, is simply that he was in a state of acute and severe stress, at times only semi-conscious, with his memory for events after finding his mother dead very impaired.

...I comment, exactly.

That Robin Bain put blood on the inside of David’s duvet and on his light switch

ans.That Robin Bain probably put blood on David’s light switch; and the blood on the inside of David’s duvet may have come from Robin, David (who had blood on him) or the cat or dog

That there is an innocent explanation for why David says he put on washing before he discovered the bodies, yet there is a blood print on the washing machine.

ans.That the innocent explanation for why David says he put on washing before he discovered the bodies is that he was following his usual routine, and the print (possibly blood) on the washing machine probably arose from handling the bloodied clothes.

That Laniet was being paranoid when she told friends she was scared of David

ans.That Laniet told her friends that she was scared of the meeting, and that David wouldn’t let her duck out of it. And that this has been interpreted as somehow sinister.

That the “family meeting” David called the previous night and insisted everyone attended was not a way to make sure everyone would be at home to kill.

ans.That the “family meeting” called the previous night and David insisted everyone attended was merely a family meeting when the family had not been together for a while – possibly a Quaker ‘meeting’. And that this has been interpreted as somehow sinister.

That Robin Bain would wear a hat while shooting himself in the head.

ans.That Robin Bain wouldn’t bother to remove his hat to shoot himself in the head, just push it to one side. And that this has been interpreted as somehow sinister.

That even though David told a relative he hated his father, his father did not know this and deliberately decided David was the only one who deserved to live

ans.That David told a relative he hated his father when trying to accept his father had killed his family. That for some reason his father decided David was the only one who deserved to stay.

That David either imagined hearing Laniet gurgling or she gurgled 20 minutes after death

ans.That David either imagined hearing Laniet gurgling, or she gurgled after death, or he mistook something else for gurgling

That Laniet allegations of incent with Robin was true, as was her claims she had given birth three times by the age of 12 and a half.

ans.That Laniet was making allegations of Robin sexually abusing her, and that her claims of having had a baby or an abortion may be true or may be symptomatic of a disturbed girl.

That Robin Bain managed to kill four family members without a single trace of his blood, skin, or DNA being left at the scene.

ans.That Robin Bain killed four family members, leaving traces of his blood his blood and DNA in several places in the house and the caravan.

That it is a coincidence that on the morning of the murders Bain took his dog onto a property, ensuring he would be noticed to give him an alibi.

ans.That Bain had an alibi the morning of the murders having been seen on the paper round at the normal times by several witnesses.

That the magazine found balanced on an edge next to Robin was not placed there by David but fell onto its edge from Robin’s arms.

ans.That the magazine found balanced on an edge next to Robin may have been placed there by Robin or may have fallen like that due to proximity with Robin’s hand.

...I comment, I don't accept that it fell in that way. Also I don't accept that the magazine might not have been placed in that fashion sometime during the inquiry when items of were being moved. Regardless, the situation of the magazine makes no purchase against the forensic evidence showing Robin as killer and suicidee.

34. That a sickly Robin Bain managed to overpower his teendage son who put up a furious fight

That Robin Bain managed to overpower his teenage son who was partly incapacitated by a shot through his hand and a gouge through his scalp

...I comment, as I understand the gouge through the scalp may have also resulted in Stephen's death without further effort by the killer?

That Robin Bain went and got the newspaper from outside, despite planning to shoot himself

ans.That either Robin or David Bain brought the newspaper from outside.

...I comment, no point delving into what Robin may have been thinking if he did in fact bring the paper inside. Inconclusive.

Farah also points out a few more things you need to understand to understand that Robin Bain shot himself.

1) There was evidence of a close-contact shot (there was: blood inside the barrel of the rifle caused by ‘drawback’) which is much more likely in suicide (it is).

2) That Robin Bain was absolutely typical of men who commit this sort of atrocity, while David Bain would have had to be a psychopath, and he is not.

3) That the allegations of incest provide an explanation of a possible trigger, but the incest does not have to be proven.

4) That the signs of possible depression in Robin Bain are explanatory but not essential.

5) That the media reporting of the trial was disgracefully one-sided, and anyone trying to form an opinion based on media reports alone is disadvantaged.

6) That there are people who have a vested interest in David Bain being thought guilty despite the verdicts

...I comment, thanks for the above Farah. Trust my comment is taken with generosity and I note, and accept your neutrality on some issues of which I have more forceful views.